Ohlbe
★★★

France,
2009-07-23 14:04
(5774 d 20:10 ago)

Posting: # 3982
Views: 8,180
 

 WHO Notice of Concern to a CRO [GxP / QC / QA]

Dear all,

WHO just posted on its website its first "Notice of Concern" (sort of warning letter) sent to a CRO.

From the details given it seems that not everybody had received and understood the message from their inspections in 2004.

Regards
Ohlbe
Helmut
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Vienna, Austria,
2009-07-23 14:50
(5774 d 19:24 ago)

@ Ohlbe
Posting: # 3983
Views: 6,531
 

 WHO Notice of Concern to a CRO

Dear Ohlbe,

fascinating reading matter!
It's hard to tell which part I liked the most, but the PDF of a chromatogram generated two days before the actual analysis of the sample is one of my favorites. Since a time machine needs exotic matter to stabilize a wormhole these guys a real pro's (at least when science fiction comes into play). Or maybe just their PC's system clock needs an overhaul?

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ElMaestro
★★★

Denmark,
2009-07-24 13:18
(5773 d 20:56 ago)

@ Helmut
Posting: # 3985
Views: 6,252
 

 WHO Notice of Concern to a CRO

❝ Or maybe just their PC's system clock needs an overhaul?


Or maybe 'someone' in that company needs a keelhaul? I don't think any of WHO's documents specifically forbid using keelhauling as corrective action.

Re. section 5 where ref. is made to §6.7 "The method validation ... not be ensured"
I fully agree. In principle there is, as I see it, an element of scientific assessment in that statement. The problem here is perhaps not necessarily (lack of) compliance with some internal procedures but rather bad science. To generalise my point, if a company is compliant with its procedures but the procedures are bad, is this then a GxP issue or is it something else?


Best regards
EM.
Helmut
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Vienna, Austria,
2009-07-27 21:19
(5770 d 12:55 ago)

@ ElMaestro
Posting: # 3989
Views: 6,274
 

 Bad scientific practices

Hi ElMaestro!

Strongly support keelhauling.

❝ […] The problem here is perhaps not necessarily (lack of) compliance with some internal procedures but rather bad science. To generalise my point, if a company is compliant with its procedures but the procedures are bad, is this then a GxP issue or is it something else?


In my understanding you are targeting a main problem with GxP. From a historical perspective GxP (I think GLP was the first) the main idea was to prevent fraud. If everything is documented, you are able to reconstruct how a result was produced (yes, and why, by whom, etc). There's no scientific evaluation within GxP. If a procedure is bad science – but well documented – it is more likely GxP compliant than a genius’ badly documented work. If Fleming’s lab was not molding away during a vacation, we would not know penicillin. Do you think that Watson & Crick would have ‘survived’ a GLP-inspection? ;-)

I often hear ‘Well, we have an SOP for it!’ – but procedures in the SOP are bullshit from a scientific point of view. Remember a quote in one of our previous discussions. I always state ‘critical points’ not only in an SOP, but also in the protocol. So at least both the EC and regulators know what I indent to do. During an inspection IMHO you have better prospects for a procedure in an approved protocol, rather than an SOP only.

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ElMaestro
★★★

Denmark,
2009-07-27 23:23
(5770 d 10:50 ago)

@ Helmut
Posting: # 3990
Views: 6,184
 

 Award

Hi HS,

❝ Strongly support keelhauling.


Tonnerre de Brest, just tell me where and when to start. And trust me I do have a few other tricks onboard my mighty fine vessel in case there are some stubborn specimens out there.

‘critical points’ not only in an SOP, but also in the protocol. So at least both the EC and regulators know what I indent to do. During an inspection IMHO you have better prospects for a procedure in an approved protocol, rather than an SOP only.


That is clearly the way to go. HS +10 points.

EM.
Helmut
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Vienna, Austria,
2009-07-28 14:39
(5769 d 19:35 ago)

@ ElMaestro
Posting: # 3991
Views: 6,059
 

 Award

Ahoy, ElMaestro!

❝ Tonnerre de Brest, […]



Mille millions de mille milliards de mille sabords! Sur commande, mon capitaine Haddock!

❝ […] HS +10 points.


Well, thanks! But in the future, please keep the score at 9.9 – leaving an incentive for improvement. :-D

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