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Oiinkie ☆ The Netherlands, 2014-07-01 17:02 (4371 d 02:27 ago) Posting: # 13190 Views: 8,805 |
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Hi All, I have a rather 'stupid' question... We all know that in planning a BE study and estimating/calculating sample sizes, we should never assume a GMR of 1.00, but always plan more conservatively by taking a GMR of 0.95 or less (or 1.0526 or more), especially when no pilot has been performed (apart from not treating a CV reported earlier in a pilot or literature as 'carved in stone'). I have been struggling a bit with a CRO, who quite reluctantly keep on planning with a GMR of 1.00 (and a CV carved in stone). I have stated that no product would ever give a GMR of exactly 1.00 (or a CV would be reproducible) and that they are always underestimating sample sizes (but then they compensate it by including a few additional subjects in their calculations to "protect the study's power" stating that they in the end come to the same sample size, which is the world upside-down, and makes me laugh and cry at the same time ![]() ). As a standard, I would like them to perform the calculations with a GMR of 0.95 (if no other information on the in vivo performance is available and dissolution shows no apparent difference). In the end I am the sponsor so they will do as I tell them to, but it would help to put an end to this misery and to convince them if anyone would have a reference (to an article or guideline, preferably EMA) or a solid justification on especially the GMR to take into account when planning a BE study... I am running out of justifications, rationales, creativity, energy and persuasive power with these guys ![]() Many thanks in advance. — Regards, Oiinkie |
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ElMaestro ★★★ Denmark, 2014-07-01 17:19 (4371 d 02:10 ago) @ Oiinkie Posting: # 13193 Views: 7,419 |
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Hi Oiinkie, ❝ In the end I am the sponsor so they will do as I tell them to, but it would help to put an end to this misery and to convince them if anyone would have a reference (to an article or guideline, preferably EMA) or a solid justification on especially the GMR to take into account when planning a BE study... I am running out of justifications, rationales, creativity, energy and persuasive power with these guys As the sponsor your word is indisputable. You have done what you can, it seems. Never argue with a fool - they will drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience NN. So just let it go. There's a ton of threads on this forum about it, and surely the CRO has been visiting them or reading books or papers about BE from time to time. If they won't listen to common sense, perhaps it is your choice of CRO that needs further consideration rather than an improvement of your persuasive powers. In perspective, I work a lot on inhalation drugs where ivivc's are outright terrible. There is no in vitro method that provides assurance that the GMR is not worse than 0.95 or even 0.90. But the guys who fund the stuff refuse to understand that. Armani suits do strange things to people. 80% of equivalence studies for inhalation drugs tend to fail for that reason. — Pass or fail! ElMaestro |
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Helmut ★★★ ![]() Vienna, Austria, 2014-07-01 18:41 (4371 d 00:48 ago) @ Oiinkie Posting: # 13194 Views: 7,679 |
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Hi Oiinkie, you deserve my sincerest sympathy. IMHO, it is almost futile to deal with people showing a combination of ignorance and resistance against advice. Below sumfink copypasted from my standard response (that’s the most basic level I managed to go) – which “works” in most cases. If anybody has a more comprehensible explanation – suggestions are welcome. Alternatively tell the CRO to go to hell. ══════════════════════════════╬══════════════════════════════ In sample size estimation we have these four variables (order as given in many guidelines):
#3 is fixed by regulatory authorities. Generally α is set to 0.05, leading to the 1–2α = 90% confidence interval. ══════════════════════════════╬══════════════════════════════ ❝ […] As a standard, I would like them to perform the calculations with a GMR of 0.95 (if no other information on the in vivo performance is available and dissolution shows no apparent difference). Yep, makes sense. See my example about the precision of measured potency above. Note that for NTIDs the FDA requires tighter specs for batch release (±5% instead of ±10%).1 ❝ […] a reference (to an article or guideline, preferably EMA)…
BTW, the two Lászlós in their paper2 about sample size estimation of HVDs/HVDPs for reference-scaling recommend a larger deviation of the GMR. Quoting the discussion section: Designing BE studies for highly variable drugs ❝ … or a solid justification on especially the GMR to take into account when planning a BE study... See above. Assuming a GMR of 1 and adding some subjects on top is solid crap. ❝ Agree. BTW, did you notice this post?
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). As a standard, I would like them to perform the calculations with a GMR of 0.95 (if no other information on the in vivo performance is available and dissolution shows no apparent difference). 

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